private practice development

[Pompal 09.]

I wanted to start a new thread about jumping the hurdles (or picking yourself up & jumping again!) that are necessary for openning up your own practice, signing commercial leases... better yet *negotiating* commercial leases, zoning, etc.I have met with a contractor/developer who has an awesome 900sqft loft space to offer. Its in a very attractive new commercial build. It looks like a huge mansion (not victorian, but I don't have the right word grasped) with a wrap around decking patio. I will take some pics today of the outside (the exterior is finished, they are doing the detailed buid-outs for the first tenants openning next month).I have discussed some of the aspects of getting started with some private friends/colleagues, but thought it would be great info to share in real world terms of openning your own offices, wellness centers, etc.Dealing with commercial leasing (as opposed to renting/subletting a room in a salon, etc) is new to me, so I've got alot to learn. Here are the steps that I'm faced with at this point in my adventure:I've seen the building & met with the owner/contractor. He showed me his loft, which is the same gist as mine would be. Then he took me up to what exists of the place I'm looking at. Currently it is a 500sq ft mezzanine within one of the larger ground level suites. The stairway would be moved & a door/entrance created for the loft space.What I've seen, I love.We discussed costs & he was very helpful in giving me info & perameters to guestimate whether or not I could afford the venture. (how much rent/triple net will be, deposit, tenent improvement costs guide to estimate & stay within budget, special feature details like a sink in every treatment room, etc, to comply with city codes for my business type.) I am supposed to call him Monday & express my seriousness or not & then we move forward to planning the build-out, lease agreement, etc.Everything I've read before about commercial leases says that "everything is negotiable". So, I have to get up the gumption to negotiate. I can do it, but *Yikes*!Is that enough to start off a good thread? Hope so. I'll share more as I go along.Jill/Sagetherapist

 

[leah5302003]

WOW!  What an exciting adventure.  Remember, worst case scenario... things don't work out and you've learned alot of next time.  Best case scenario, you get to move and be closer to your dream practice!    I wish I personally had some advice to share with you, as you inevitably have advice to share with the rest of us.  But, as I am sure I can speak for the majority of us on this board, we believe in you and have the utmost confidence that you can accomplish this.  If it's meant to be, it will be.

 

[Clayton]

private practice development

I took some photos of the place I'm looking at today. (I took them yesterday too, but in the pouring rain... am I a die-hard or what?) They are at
http://www.msnusers.com/mrgang

Its the exterior only, of course. If I enter into agreement I'll be able to post more.

Something that Joe E wrote about wellness centers got me a thinkin. I would like to have pilates & yoga for small groups available. And offer classes for personal enrichment.

?? Will that help me out with some of the restrictive requirements of my local massage establishment codes? Like a sink with running hot & cold water in every treatment room.

One thing the contractor shared with me was that there are some very reasonable 2 gal under-the-cabinet electrical water heaters that would run less than $100 each. That might serve me better than getting a gas water heater & running all the copper tubing, etc.

Since it is a loft space, I thought why not look around the web for loft decor ideas; specifically creative & beautiful ideas to divide spaces, etc. I do want completed walls & doors for treatment rooms, but the common areas could be used for a variety of things, so moveable, beautiful 'dividers' might be nice. Once I was in a cool bookstore that turned yoga studio in the evenings. they had 4 ft high bookshelves on roller casters (that locked) & they just got wheeled out of the way for yoga time. Interesting. I don't know if I can use it, but interesting.

Jill/Sagetherapist

 

[lil]

Jill, it looks like a lovely building. And it gets you away from the next door episode (how did that turn out?)  Good luck, and good luck with the negotiating.  Be pushy! Though it's so hard when you don't know what you need to be pushy about!Re: hot waterWhen I was a poverty stricken student at university I lived in a warehouse.  We had a hot water tank connected to a cold water tap like a washing machine that plugged into a normal powerpoint.  It had a shower head and tap off it. Very expensive running it as a shower, but it did limit the lengths of showers, which is a good thing in share accommodation (it was about 4ft high and a foot square, plus the shower head).  I imagine smaller versions that just serviced a sink would be available.You’re going to have to get the plumbing done anyway and the additional expense of having to include the hot water pipes is probably fairly negligible if you are doing the cold water at the same time.  Gas is probably cheaper to run than individual electric systems? Though you've got the extra wait for the water to come through from the heater to the tap.  All a bit 6 of one half a dozen of the other....

 

[Cihle]

Jill,  One thing I have learned is to get a commercial real estate agent of your own, they know all the ends and out.  It may be to late in your case just because you have talked to the listing agent already and they get very testy over that.  But for anyone else get someone to work for you.  The great thing about it is they make their money by getting you in the location.  You don't have to pay them.  I leased my current location 5 years ago.  They former property manager (the one I dealt with) and I have started talking about a new location.  He informed me that if I would have had my own agent I could have gotten my current location for about $200 a month less then I got, and I would have gotten even more in improvements.  He informed me of little tricks to look for:1. Measure the space your self, and dont be afraid to discuss the differnce with the listing agent.   (alot of agents list the size of the space by using the the outside deminsions.2.  Don't ever be afraid to ask for what ever you may want, worst thing to happen is they say no.  They won't hold any bad feelings, its part of the job to them.  This agent told me that if someone ask for alot and seems in control, that he sometimes would tell them "I don't think we can do that but what if I got you XX months of free rent."  (found out they would have given me 6 months.  I only got 2 (didn't ask for any more)).3.  You can ask to be taken out of your triple net and ask for a gross rent (one that doesn't change when they have a big expense).  Understand with NNN (triple net) If the plumbing backs up and floods the first floor.  The tenents end up paying for the repairs, not the building owners.  Just a word of caution.  I hope some of what I have learned will help, either you or someone else getting ready to do the same thing.Big Dog

 

[Ryan I]

Big Dog,Thank you.Believe it or not, I have been waiting & waiting for you to reply! The man I am dealing with is the property owner, building contractor and his own leasing agent! They have been creating sites like this for a while all over Arizona. I am pretty green about all of this, I'll be the first to admit. We have agreed to add the rent & NNN together for a 36 month rental amount. And the tenent improvements (walls, doors, etc to create the individual work rooms) will be factored into the 3 year lease/rent price. If I choose a one year lease, I have to pay all separately.He doesn't want to enter into longer leases because he admittedly wants to be able to adjust rent to economy trends. His rent plus NNN is actually about 2-3 dollars a sq ft less than the Gilbert average for new builds (and I have confirmed). I also looked up his contracting history & licensing info. There are no complaints or even resolved complaints for his company since 1987. I do know a woman who operates a business on his other property in Farmhouse Meadows (The Brownie Connection). I only know her casually (she gets her hair done at the salon), but its been suggested  to me to ask other people who are entered into leases with them if they are happy with the business relationship, etc.One thing I have to research is the price of tenent improvements. He quoted me $350 per door and $55 per linear foot of wall space. The walls have insulation plus sound board (I saw it in the suites he toured me through, including the one I am interested in). The lower floors have 12 ft ceilings, so they are $70 per linear foot. He classifies the sinks as s'special needs' improvements & has said that he would require those paid for up front. I am hoping that *this* all here in this paragraph is the negotiable part!All the "shigles" (signs) that'll hang on the wrap around porch for signage will be uniform & are to be made by the same company. they are actually the same people that did our Shea Marie stuff. they are good people to do biz with & I'm cool with that. There wil be a large, general "Homestead Suites" sign that has listings of the businesses within. The sign is large & very nice/easy reading. I'm pleased with that. I don't know if there's a charge for that though.Pretty much all these details are going to be negotiated (and more, I'm sure!!!!) very soon. The first businesses are slated to open next month, so he is asking for comittment (deposit & entering into lease negotiations) now.You're absolutely right about the outside measurements issue. He came right out & told me that was what he based the sq ftg on when I met with him. I was asking why 25 x 38 equalled 964 instead of 950 (or the 900 he was casually mentioning when we talked over the phone.). I figured stuff like that would definitely be a factor. I am prepared to ask for free rent and/or to negotiate the rent/NNN total lease payts.Melb,Thanks for the insight about the plumbing. I do have a friend who does contracting work that I can ask for some details from. You're right. If I have to have plumbing run for cold, do the hot at the same time. And gas IS cheaper than electric, but somehow, I imagine that this guy (contractor) is not trying to get me to have a larger utility bill. He has no sense of profit from that.I have so much to look into, and quickly. I don't feel rushed or pushed into a corner though, so I am not making decisions with my hair on fire.I have been thinking of business names. Am thinking about 'Homestead Bodyworks' (cuz I want more than just massage going on there), 'The Massage Loft at Homestead Suites', etc. I am jsut so excited about the whole idea. Thanks everyone!Jill/sagetherapist

 

[Lissa]

Jill,  Remember this, if he has an ongoing relationship with the community then the chance are that he wants you to succeed in business.  Yes, with a lease you are saying that you will pay him $XXX per month for the entire time of the lease.  But if you go out of business, chances are you no longer have any money.  So, why would they come after you to collect they would just be out extra legal fees.  (If you are broke, then you can't pay those either.)   If he is trying to build up the area he is looking for long term payouts.  If he can help you build a good solid business, then he could profit from you for many years to come.  That is his goal, make money for the long term.  Sorry, I don't check the board more.  I have been real busy with a few other projects.  I just increased the 'Vendor" work I do with a major employer in the area and just took over a chair for city development for the Chamber of Commerce.  Luckily, I graduated in July or else I don't think I could be doing all this.  You can always send me a message, since I see that when I first log on. (I don't always get to every message, it seems like I only read Business and the Technique sections now)Big Dog

 

[jboi4life83]

Big Dog,Thanks for writing & thanks for the invite to ask further, etc.I do feel the guy is there to create a solid venue for success for me; therefore him.We spoke today & he invited me to look over his lease (I'll get it on Wednesday). The next step would be to come to terms & sign the lease, giving him my deposit.He asked if I would be interested in one of the front spaces (facing the main road) on the ground level; splitting it with a realtor that's interested. That would be nice, but the rent is higher (.25/sqft) and the improvements would be more costly since the ceilings are 12 ft high. On Sunday, the people who had 'spoken for' (they had the lease, but had not signed yet) told him that their financing fell through. So that gives me an insight as to how he operates with *some* good faith & *good neighborly* ways. He had said that the front property was already in the works when I had asked him last. I do realise though that he'll just juggle things around like a jigsaw puzzle until all the spaces are filled & paying him.I asked him about the front space with the turret (see pics?)... that space is cool. Says its the same situation:  spoken for & not signed, but he remains true to his discussions with the parties he already spoke with.My stepdad is helping me to consider which areas to focus my negotiations on. Also, helping by giving me a few new ideas that I hadn't thought of before.Boy, its good to have help at this seforum.xxxe.Where will all my friends be when I want to move my stationery table up the stairs to the loft??? ha ha Jill/Sagetherapist