What are those crunchies????

[toughcountryfucker]

OK, I don't think this belongs here but I don't know where else to put it.I worked on a friend today and found she had a LOT of "crunchy" areas all around her scapula.  What is that??  ???I remember something about crepitation from school, but again, what is that??  Anyone know?  I hate not having an answer when people ask me. (sure, I could say "it's crepitation" but then they want to know more and I don't have a response.)And does anyone know how to reduce them or make them go away?  I have crunchies too!  THANX!  ;D

 

[Mary Boo]

According to Travell and Simon, those are deposits of cellular debris caught between taut bands of muscle fiber.  Depending on how long they've been there, they can be released and flushed out.  Near joints they could be little bits of calcium sent to the joint to "stabilize" the stressed joint.  In many clients, these move with ischemic compression, and or friction ----- in some clients with chronic tension in an area, they don't........Good luck..... Linda in NC

 

[Witches]

What are those crunchies????

Common term (from Travell) is trigger points. We've studied a bit in school, and I am currently reading a book called The Triger Point Therapy Workbook by Clair Davies (available at Amazon or local bookstores). Travell has done extensive research on these, and claims that 90-95% of people's pain is related in some form to trigger points. The workbook goes into approaches to alleviate them; it is written in the form of a self-treatment guide, but the techniques, ait minor modification, can be used on clients very effectively.

 

[lonely_soul]

This post is for Merlescuz.  Hey, I got C. Davies book, as well, and I really do like it and use it, but:  in the intro Davies goes into this long diatribe about how he, as a layperson, "discovered" the Travell/Simons books and after using the info to self-treat he felt compelled to rewrite the info into a self treatment format.  He says this as though it was an original idea, when we M.T.s all know that Bonnie Prudden did this years earlier, and very successfully, in her book "Pain Erasure."  I guess he was unaware of her work.  

 

[Peter J]

What are those crunchies????

I don't think they're trigger points - they don't hurt and they don't refer.  Plus I've never found trigger points to "crunch" - have you?

 

[boom]

What are those crunchies????  (answer)

Ok, I looked it up:Crepitus:  A crinkly, crackling or grating feeling or sound in the joints, skin or lungs. Crepitus in soft tissues is often due to gas, most often air, that has penetrated and infiltrated an area where it should not normally be, as for example the soft tissues beneath the skin (a condition called subcutaneous emphysema). Crepitus in a joint can represent cartilage wear in the joint space.In case anyone else was wondering too.  ;D

 

[Pompal 09.]

What are those crunchies????

Calcium phosphate crystals form (precipitate) within dysfuctional tissues. The crunchies. yes I find crystals in trigger points and in scar tissue and in dehydrated fascia

 

[Jackie M]

What are those crunchies????

This post is for Merlescuz.  Hey, I got C. Davies book, as well, and I really do like it and use it, but:  in the intro Davies goes into this long diatribe about how he, as a layperson, "discovered" the Travell/Simons books and after using the info to self-treat he felt compelled to rewrite the info into a self treatment format.  He says this as though it was an original idea, when we M.T.s all know that Bonnie Prudden did this years earlier, and very successfully, in her book "Pain Erasure."  I guess he was unaware of her work.  

Thank you for this information. I have heard of Bonnie Prudden, but had not heard of her book. Is it a worthwhile one to have? NMT is fascinating to me, something I will definitely be pursuing for CEU's after schoool. Eventually I will get the Travell, just can't afford it right now.

 

[Howdy!!]

I am a little confused as to what you are asking. I fisrt thought that when you were saying "crunchies" you were referring to the calcium deposits that build up in your palms of hands and bottoms of feet. Thats the only "crunchies" I have ever heard of. Those are fun to break up. I have never heard of trigger points being called "crunchies" and have been practicing massage quite awhile. But I guess "crunchies" is not really a medical term, so it could pretty much refer to whatever you wish. As for something crunching arounf the scapula, do they feel like tiny tiny crystals poppping(like Pop Rocks maybe?) Or do they feel a little larger? If you say larger, I would just iamgine they are little trigger points. A lot of people get them there due to being on the computer or playing tennis golf, whatever. I would not try to bounce over them and make them "pop" that does NOT feel good. Apply pressure with thumb or elbow anywhere from thirty seconds to three minutes or until you feel a release. You should not try more than three times. Sometimes they just wont let go in the first session or if they are due to stress.  If they done feel pain in them, I was always told that when a knot was so tight for so long, it loses nerve sensation until it is looseened up. Good Luck!

 

[Jeremy]

sorry, guess I wasn't clear!When I said crunchies, I mean they sound like rice crispies when you either PROM the shoulder, or friction over them.  It's kind of similar to the popping sound/feeling you can get when skin rolling, but much louder.  (Pop rocks....yeah, they sound like that too!)The crunchies I was talking about aren't trigger points - which is why I was asking if anyone knew what else they could be.  Thanks for your reply!

 

[swelou]

What are those crunchies????

I have always thought they were 'debris'. Once upon a time, I was told 'lactic acid'. After reading current studies, etc, I think they are debris of a different nature. ha. They break up & seem to melt away. When they do, there seems to be less pain or tenderness & that's great.Reason why I'm posting is to share something I have been trying lately when holding pressure on a trigger point. While holding my thumb static 'on the spot', I tap or strike my own distal thumb joint, do a couple of 'combing' passes & move on. About 90% of the time, the area softens very quickly. Much more quickly than holding for the standard 90 seconds, etc. It saves my thumbs too! A friend recently did this to me & taught me. I love it. I'm sure it has a proper name & place in a particular type of therapy, but its amazingly effective.Jill/sagetherapist

 

[Kanyee !]

What are those crunchies????

While holding my thumb static 'on the spot', I tap or strike my own distal thumb joint, do a couple of 'combing' passes & move on.

Jill, how long do you hold you thumb static and tap/strike. . .and can you describe your 'combing' passes? Do you do that parallel to the mm fibers or perpendicular? Thanks~Samantha

 

[Evja Teacher]

What are those crunchies????

Jill, how long do you hold you thumb static and tap/strike. . .and can you describe your 'combing' passes? Do you do that parallel to the mm fibers or perpendicular?

Thanks
~Samantha

I only have to hold long enough to make sure my body mechanics are correct & to 'set my intention'. (very briefly) I tap twice or three times. My description of combing means alternating raking strokes with my thumbs, in multiple directions; no deep pressure needed. I simply experimented & landed on a cool technique that gives me really wonderful results so far.

My work involves the clients body held staticly in various 'platforms' or positions AND while moving & stretching. I was taught to always regard the body as three dimensional & moving. It gives you alot more options than simply repeating strokes on the back or front, etc. I reach underneath, etc (example: combing the pectoralis with four fingers while the client is prone, with the arm draped a number of ways before working the scap, etc)

Jill/Sagetherapist

 

[Meshuggah]

I know this is an older thread, but I've also heard that crunchy tissue explained as "fibrotic tissue" or a fibrosis in the muscle.