Partytreff and FKK experience

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Two from Germany, one from Slovakia, the other one from Serbia. I saw also some black girls, but they were pretty elusive and could not talk to them. And alos some three other girls. Don't know from where. It was pretty early, when I was there so it might happen that later others are coming for work.

I took a busty german one, maybe that is why it was so expensive. :confused:
There was also a nice short haired blonde, with slender body and nice small tits, but maybe I'll go for it next time.

Or I'll go to Augsburg... :D
 
Had no time to go to Augsburg, but tried out a club found on the net. It is called Palazzo der Sinne and placed on the Frankfurter ring.
Interesting concept, but not for the hurried ones, as I was. Entry was 35 EUR, that includes looking around talking to the girls, having non alcoholic drinks and using the sauna, whirlpool, etc.
Girls were interesting, from different countries. Some excellent looking, but also one XXL type. The price was 200 EUR for one hour of fun, with BBBJ no final in the mouth or on the tits. Pretty expensive I say. :( Or maybe it was because of me, I was in a hurry. :(
 
Best place around Munich is FKK colloseeum in Augsburg, 45 min by train form Munich and then a 10 minute taxi ride.
 
I would like to know about FKK clubs around Munich. Can you help?
 
Thanks for the report. Even though you had a mixed experience and lost a lot of time and money chasing around you left satisfied. This is typical for Germany. There are great places and dumps, bargains and rip-offs, and it's not the price level that will indicate quality and honesty. In any case you could have used a guide. I (bilingual En/Ger) am starting a guide service for individuals and groups (2-8) traveling in luxury motorhomes throughout the Frankfurt-Dortmund-Aachen pussy triangle. Cost will be very affordable. So anybody interested please contact me by Private Message.
Check my other posts in mpnet for details. Don't want to look like a spammer.

Definitions:
FKK Club: Pay admission (Eu 25-60), get naked, pick a naked girl and pay her (Eu 25-80), this is the best business model since the girls often actually pay the owners admission fees and the guests pay also. Good value for usually nice facilities and fringe benefits: drinks, buffet food, bathhouse ameneties.
Pauschalclub = flat rate club: Pay one fee (Eu 75-150) for a block of time 3-8 hrs long and do as many girls as you get hard for. Not very popular with staff so usually nobody above 6/7 here.
Partytreff = party meeting: Something like a swing club with paid females. Sometimes flat rate, sometimes admission + session fee. The bargain basement of the business (Eu 25-85).
Laufhaus, Bordell = brothel, classic dormitory style apartment building with up to 9 floors where hookers actually pay rent by the day or week, live and conduct business. Often built by the municipalities, they are quickly becoming the dinosaurs of the biz. But some, like http://Pascha.de are still going strong due to added attractions like rock concerts by name bands (!), FKK style party and meeting spaces, roof gardens, night clubs with US-style table dancing ect. Bargains from Eu 30 'with orgasm warranty' (at the Pascha. I kid you not).
Privatclub: small operations with 2~6 girls run out of private apartments/flats and houses. If you find a good one, go back. But a lot of running around until you do.
Wohnungsprostitution (apartment pr.): same, but only 1 or 2 girls, often freelancers or part-timers who are the actual tenants.
Strassenstrich = street hookers, illegal almost everywhere. But some operate in nice motor homes or campers (caravans) on Autobahn parking lots, and can be fun as a variation on a theme.
 
The way I see it (I may not be an expert on the topic either) is the following: FKK: you pay an entry fee which includes drinks, using the pool, sauna etc. and pay for each time you take a girl upstairs. With those Party-Treffs (at least the ones I know, i.e., see the links I posted) you pay a fee which includes everything, i.e., food, drinks, *and* girls. So if you on't mind the publicity and the girls are OK, this may be quite good a bargain depending on the time you want to stay at the place... :D

Cheers,
ANon
 
Sorry for the perhaps silly question, but what is the difference between partytreff and FKK? I am familiar with the FKKs, have been to many, but not to partytreffs...
 
I agree, if you aren't looking for a GFE experience and want to chat with a couple of girls beforehand without having to buy them drinks all the time, these part-treffs are great places.

In fact, there are similar places close to Hanover (www.baldis.de) and in between Hanover and Goettingen (www.estrifi.de). Right now, there's an entry fee of a as low as EUR 88,88 (all inclusive) available.

Since these places usually open at noon or in the afternoon, I'd advise to arrive early (and possibly leave early) in order to avoid the "cattle market experience". I (obviously ;-) find the girls to be a lot more relaxed earlier throughout the day.

Cheers,
ANon
 
After a few days work in Germany, I decided to stay an extra few days and have some fun and try out some new and old places.
Now I have been to a few FKK clubs and partytreff places, but this time without a car and being in the Dusseldorf area, I wanted to try somewhere different, but within easy reach of public transport.
I had tried to do my research over a few days, but find that the great sites that were about a few years ago have not been updated, which is a shame, but hence why I have tried to say what my experiences were:-

On the Friday afternooon I was in Krefeld and decided to visit
,Mit Fick Zentrale
Uerdingerstr. 64
47799 Krefeld.

I could not find any uptodate web site etc, but I found it was still going and arrived around 6PM. Now I have been to before, albeit around 18 Months ago.
The entrance fee was 75 Euro, which gave you unlimited soft drinks and snacks (I never did see these), so after paying my fee and getting into the old toga towel attire, I found that 4 girls were there, but all 4 were a 6 or less, so not really a great start, however I had a few drinks and as I speak very little German, tried my best to interact with the girls and around 5 men that were there. After about 30 mins a blonde women, around 40ish but the best of the bunch, asked if I wanted to go to a room, were she performed a nice BBJ and massage but no actual fucking, so whilst it was OK, I was a little dissapointed. The next girl was not very good in the looks department, but offered sex bbj etc, but the whole thing was not as I have found previously with the girls all going together in a big room, this time they just seemed to not be interested, in fact for over an hour they just sat and smoked/drinking. A couple of other girls arrived, but nothing really hot happened, so I returned back to the hotel, still fancing some action, but without any idea where next to go, apart from back to the Dussledorf, so I decided to ask the taxi driver, whom was not really very knowledgeable, however he did call up his office and they suggested a place about 15 mins drive, which I thought sounded OK.

We arrived at this very nice Villa, big gates etc and I was shown in, I did notice the taxi driver had gone to the back office and was obviously being rewarded for his delivery.........normal I think in these places, however all seemed Ok, some very nice girls but only about 6, dressed in swim suit/dress and from Germany/Russia/Austria/Belgium.

The madam explained in perfect English that the entrance was 45 Euros and that a drink was 7 euros for a beer and time with a girl 140 Euro..........now I have been to these kind of places in Spain and for an hour etc it can be OK, however very soon the old "commercial" enterprise stepped in, with the girls asking to have a drink............and they only drink champagne.....anyway I decline and enjoy the use of the swimming pool and decide to select the nice leggy Blonde, about 30 from Austria.....(you will see I like blondes!!), we start to walk towards the stairs when I am asked to pay for the time to be spend. I am asked for 250 Euro!!!! the rate for one hour, the 140 is only for one hour, plus we needed a bottle of champagne to enjoy ourselves at 190 Euro at which point I lost it and explained that whilst I am not afraid to spend money, I was not going to have the piss taken out off me, so I said I was leaving, to which she got a bit upset and suggested I just sit outside with the girls but I had, had enough, I left and called a taxi and returned to the hotel.......but pleased I had not been driven by the passion and ended up with a 1000 Euro bill..................I cant remember the places name or place as I write this, but I will find it and amend this post, because these types of places need shaming, its one thing to pay top Dollar for a nice hooker, but not when they try and slam you each way.........

So pissed off, I went to sleep and ready for the main reason I had stayed, to sample a place I had found via a German forum:-

I had emailed a place called partytreff Osnabruck ,which on their website
(http://www.partytreff-osnabrueck.de) offered a variety of excitment with special guests, inclusive food/drink and plenty of girls.....so off on the train and to Osnabruck.

The email back from this palce advised me of a nice hotel 100 meters from the house, which is handy not to have to get a taxi etc at the end. They also said a porn star would be coming that evening, anyway duly arrived in Osnabruck and a short taxi to the hotel, I had a sleep and got showered and went to the place around 4PM, a few hours after it had opened.
I was greeted with a rather pleasant young girl who explained things and took the 130 Euro entrance fee.
After getting changed into the usual attire, I had a look around and was pleased to find around 15 girls, from Russia/Germany etc and a nice buffet of food, together with a BBQ.
There were about 8 men there at this time, the girls were very friendly and very soon I found myself upstairs on the main rather big bed with a couple of girls. Now the Girls were mostly 7's a couple of 8's and one or two low raters (depending on what floats your boat).
It would appear that some of the girls wear red wrist bands which means they offer anal, BBBJ to completion etc, however at this time the place was great, plenty of girls, drink, outside play area etc, but as time went on and more and more people came, it started to resemble a cattle market, the girls were always on the go, they were enthusiastic for real, but at around when 10PM, the porn star arrived and did a turn, the place was just crammed with around 30-40 guys, no "single unpaid girls" had turned up, and as beer was available, some people were a little worse for wear!!!
I made my way out, satisfied, but perhaps please I had turned up when I did as seeing a girl just go with one man after another then another, really does not turn me on.................but to be honest a great experience, not for the shy or fainthearted!!!!

So Sunday and with a flight back from Dortmund the following day, I made my way to the city and planned a trip to a couple of FKK's I had found on the web in the area.

I had decided to visit the FKK partyclub 370 (http://www.fkk-deutschland.com/), which their website seemed to show a nice place and with lots of girls etc, swimming pool and the usual inclusive drinks, all for the price of 35 Euro.
So again I find myself in the middle of the afternoon, arriving at the place.
I was met at the door by the manager who explained the form...entrance fee etc, and a trip with a girl 20 Euro (!!!) which I thought a little cheap, but anyway, back to the old towel and flip flops and into the bar area. Now the place is very well fitted and the pool area very nice, but and there is always a but, the place had around 15 men around the bar area but no girls.............so after around 30 mins and only seeing one girl, I asked and was told as it was Sunday on 4 girls were working!!!!, So I think to myself with the current ratio of men to women this is again like the old market meat, so not to impressed, I take advantage of the pool and drinks, have a quick look at the girls who looked OK and decided to quit and put this place off the map for any future visits, but with a misson in mind, I had details of another FKK very local, which I had looked at on the web site but placed in 2nd choice.........but now I had to try it.

This place FKK-Club Aplerbeck, (http://www.fkk-aplerbeck.de), is located just outside the town and is in a rather large house.
I arrived and again the entrance was 35 Euro, again the price for a girl was 20 Euro.

This time the girls were all around the lounge, some naked, others just with a towel around, blondes, dark, tall short, in fact around 15 girls, all 8's.....AT LAST I SAY.... and as an advantage most spoke English.
I chose a blonde girl from Russia, whom when upstairs explained the 20 Euro was just for a blow job, for full sex etc it was 50 Euro for half an hour or 85 for an hour.

This was full girlfriend experience, she took her time, nice massage, nice bbbj, but did not want any fingering which was a slight dissapointment, but on with the old cover and we fucked in many different positions.

Now after your session, you pay the girl directly, having left your money is a locker for just keeping money in, seperate from your clothes.

I was now on a roll, after a short while I chose another tall leggy blonde, German girl whom was into everything, BBBJ, fingering was not an issue as was anal if you wanted..........

After all the last few days activity it was time to call it a day and back to the hotel.

In all the experience was very dissapointing, perhaps just bad luck or the fact the FKK scene etc is loosing its appeal, I know previously I have been to Wiagio and Atlantis etc and perhaps I have just been spoilt, being without a car is a pain as you are limited, I will say the train system was great but you are obviously stuck to a particular area.

The partytreff scene is perhaps not for me, I dont mind a bit of fun, but having some guy wanking off watching you can be a bit off putting, seeing him stuff another girl is ok but even that starts to get a bit much after a while, anyway, Germany is still 100% better than the UK in my opinion, but in all, my best time was for sure at the last place.

I hope it not been to boring, I just hope my experience may make anybody who is in the area have an easier time finding what they want

Have Fun.
 
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  28. @ Golden Sunshine Spa:
    โœจClick on our Username and FOLLOW US for updates and special services ! โœ… Click Here Today๐ŸŒธCandy๐ŸŒธVivian๐ŸŒธXuka๐ŸŒธAmber๐ŸŒธMonika Call us โ˜Ž 905 - 265 - 2158โ˜Ž๏ธ Your ultimate service awaits! โœจ
  29. @ SugarLoveSpa:
    Friday at โค๏ธ๐Ÿ’™ ๐Ÿ’œโŽ๐—ฆ๐—จ๐—š๐—”๐—ฅ ๐—Ÿ๐—ข๐—ฉ๐—˜ ๐—ฆ๐—ฃ๐—”โŽ ๐Ÿ’–๐Ÿ’—๐Ÿ’˜: BOBO, ELLA, KELLY & TIFFANY. 1270 Finch Ave W (at Keele St), Unit 18. North York, ON โ˜Ž ๐Ÿฐ๐Ÿฏ๐Ÿณ-๐Ÿฏ๐Ÿฒ๐Ÿฑ-๐Ÿฎ๐Ÿฒ๐Ÿด๐Ÿด โ˜Ž BOBO is Chinese/Vietnamese mixed, C Cup, 5'1" and 49Kgs, she can do everything. ELLA is a lovely Thai sweetheart, 5โ€™1โ€ with C Cups, smooth skin and a very pleasing attitude. KELLY is a young Singaporean lady, slim with C Cups & liberal
  30. @ gold__rose__spa:
    ๐Ÿ’๐Ÿต1536 Warden Avenue ๐Ÿ’–๐Ÿ’•โฃ๐Ÿ’‹๐Ÿ’ฏ๐Ÿ’ฅFriday, โค๐Ÿ”บ๏ธ๐Ÿ’• Nana, small in stature, slim and fit. A very pretty girl, does a relaxing treatment and fantastic finish. ๐Ÿต Fifi, a strong, full body girl, for deep tissue treatment. ๐Ÿ’๐ŸŒน ๐Ÿ“ณ 647 346-8086๐Ÿ“ณ
  31. @ luckywellness:
    Lucky Wellness Center 4379721888 295 Eglinton Ave E,Unit 7,Mississauga We had two girls working today. Sophia and Kiki. They are young and pretty and very cute. They are good at deep relaxation massage.
  32. @ Lulu_Villa_Spa:
    Jessica Pretty Girl with amazing personality and super easy to get along with. Sasa friendly Vietnamese Judy is a gorgeous model type Vietnamese Girl Sami Vietnamese Girl Cherry ๐Ÿ’ From Malaysia Part time School girl โ˜Ž๏ธ647- 446-0886
  33. @ Double_Tree:
    โค๐Ÿ’—4271 Sheppard Avenue east ๐Ÿ’ž๐Ÿ’‹๐Ÿ’–Friday,โฃ๐Ÿ’ž Sofia, tall and slim, โฃ๐Ÿ’‹ Mary, tall and slender woman. Dark hair to shoulder. Sensual touch with a great finish +. ๐ŸŒฒ๐ŸŒฒ๐Ÿ“ž416 293-5071๐Ÿ“ž
  34. @ DareDevil:
    Blackpink Wellness โ™ฅ๏ธโ™ฅ๏ธ90 Marycroft Ave. Unit #2, Vaughan, ๐Ÿญ๐ŸฌON L4L 5Y1 (647) 395-3188. BEAUTIFUL AND SEXY GIRLS TODAY:๐ŸŒน๐ŸŒนFun Girls Julie, Akino and Beautiful Tiffany on duty ๐ŸŒน๐ŸŒน .
  35. @ DareDevil:
    ARIA WELLNESS โ™ฅ๏ธโ™ฅ๏ธADDRESS: 360 HWY 7, UNIT #6, RICHMOND HILL,647-222-5683 โ™ฅ๏ธโ™ฅ๏ธ(PHONES CALL ONLY, NO TEXT'N AVAILABLE) โ™ฅ๏ธTODAY'S Schedule!โ™ฅ๏ธ Loaded lineup with Beautiful Girls : New Girl Jenny, New Girl Grace, Superstar Ella, Young RMT Student Helen, Magical Mia and Work out๐Ÿ‹๐Ÿšด๐Ÿ’ช Babe Amy! SPECIAL PROMO 30 MINS 2 GIRLS $70 ๐ŸŒน๐ŸŒน**TODAY'S PICKS OF THE DAY IS ๐Ÿญ๐ŸฌELLA๐Ÿฌ๐Ÿญ**
  36. @ EMSpa_schedule:
    Tomorrow's sneak peek: On Friday May 16, 2025, our attendants will be Vicky ๐Ÿฅฐ, Ada ๐Ÿ˜˜, Carla โค, Cici ๐Ÿ˜ and Opal ๐Ÿฅฐ. Call us at โ˜Ž๏ธ(905) 479-6668โ˜Ž๏ธ to book!
  37. @ wilson holistic centre:
    new girl works at ๐Ÿ’‹535 Evans Ave today ๐Ÿ’•๐Ÿ’•๐Ÿ’•โ˜Ž๏ธโ˜Ž๏ธ416-531-6969โ˜Ž๏ธโ˜Ž๏ธ
  38. @ SL East Spa:
    ๐Ÿ’†โ€โ™€๐Ÿ’–Terrific Thursday ๐Ÿ’– Ultimate destination for Asian massages๐ŸŽ‰ Two fab spots: SL Richmond Hill & SL West Oakville โœจ Your passport to paradise with 10 enchanting girls fr China, HK โ€” ๐Ÿ†•Tiffany, Joey, Julie, Aaliyah, Cici, Coco, Yui, Meghan, Julia & New 34D Jasmineโ€”โ€” ready to pamper you๐ŸŽ๐Ÿ Ring us ๐Ÿ“ž647-695-6354 or text us ๐Ÿ“ฑ647-578-8169โœจ 160 East Beaver Cr., Unit 12, RichmondHill ๐Ÿ’ฐWhere Eastern charm meets Western comfort - your bliss awaits
  39. @ SpringGreen.:
    Today we have 5 girls on Thursday๏ผš๐Ÿ’‹๐Ÿ’‹New girl MIMI๐Ÿ’‹๐Ÿ’‹ apple- Sweet school girl with a large serving of naughtiness Angela- Slim beauty with long legs and nice proportions Julia- Exotic beauty with great service and attitude kโ€†k- Spunky fun in... Attachments Call and text 6478910699 ask questions thx
  40. @ wilson holistic centre:
    new girl works at ๐Ÿ’‹535 Evans Ave today ๐Ÿ’•๐Ÿ’•๐Ÿ’•โ˜Ž๏ธโ˜Ž๏ธ416-531-6969โ˜Ž๏ธโ˜Ž๏ธ
  41. @ Lilyspa1:
    Lily Spa : ๐Ÿ’ฐ๐Ÿ’ฐ100 hh all in๐Ÿ’ฐ๐Ÿ’ฐ โค๏ธโค๏ธ SuSu ( Asian )Slim , ๐Ÿ˜๐Ÿ˜Porn Service ๐Ÿฉท๐ŸฉทElena 22, Latino French, 36 DDD and ๐Ÿ‘๐Ÿ‘ASS, ๐Ÿ’‹๐Ÿ’‹Mimi 24, Asian mixed White , very open-Minded , ๐Ÿ˜ˆbbbj , DFk ๐Ÿ”ฅDuo ๐Ÿ”ฅ,โ˜Ž๏ธ 6475318288
  42. @ Lulu1980:
    Phoenix Blossom Spa ๐ŸŒน๐ŸŒน๐ŸŒน2 girls๏ผŒNina ใ€Cindy ๐Ÿ”ฅ๐Ÿ”ฅ๐Ÿ”ฅ5124 Dundas St W Etobicokeโ˜Ž๏ธ416-817-3366๐Ÿ‘ Table Shower Sea Salt Bath Body Scrub๐Ÿ˜˜ Japanese girl Nina โค๏ธ Natural Big Boobs 38 DD ๐Ÿ˜˜Pink Mini Nipples Hot body slide, super enjoyable๐Ÿ˜˜๐Ÿ˜˜๐Ÿ˜˜๐Ÿ˜˜ very provocative service๐Ÿ˜˜๐Ÿ˜˜๐Ÿ˜˜, Mia sexy girl 1.65 M.pretty boobs 36D๐Ÿ˜˜Superb service ๐Ÿ‘ massage, has therapeutic effect to loosen bones and relieve muscle pressure and will bring you unexpected service effects, she will bring you a little surpr
  43. @ Nu spring spa888:
    โค๏ธโค๏ธโค๏ธsexy hot Germany๐ŸŒธKorean ๐ŸŒธ Singapore girl working at๐Ÿ’“๐Ÿ’“ Nu spring spa โ˜Ž๏ธ416-669-8508โค๏ธโค๏ธโค๏ธ
  44. @ jrgcsn17:
    mississauga
  45. @ Golden Sunshine Spa:
    โœจClick on our Username and FOLLOW US for updates and special services ! โœ… Click Here Today๐ŸŒธAletta๐ŸŒธJessica๐ŸŒธSelina๐ŸŒธNina๐ŸŒธChelsea Call us โ˜Ž 905 - 265 - 2158โ˜Ž๏ธ Your ultimate service awaits! โœจ
  46. @ Red Rose Spa:
    ๐ŸŒธ We have 5 hot brown girls today ๐ŸŒธ MONICA, LUCY, ANGEL, JANVI, AMANDA, MEGAN, JAZMINE, MONIKA, KIRAN ๐ŸŒธ 2588 Birchmount ๐ŸŒธ 2 Invergordon ๐ŸŒธ 647-702-8800 ๐ŸŒธ Please visit for a great erotic massage
  47. @ wilson holistic centre:
    new girl works at ๐Ÿ’‹535 Evans Ave today ๐Ÿ’•๐Ÿ’•๐Ÿ’•โ˜Ž๏ธโ˜Ž๏ธ416-531-6969โ˜Ž๏ธโ˜Ž๏ธ Edit
  48. @ wonderspa:
    wonderspa: โ˜Ž๏ธ416-5000-800,L6a4H8๏ผŒopen10 to10,Ensuit shower available open long weekend ๐ŸŒน๐Ÿ”ฅbeautiful young Jessica deep tissue to relax massage back walk,hot stone๐Ÿ…sexy face sunny is very good looking,slim body ,nice body slide sweet sensual touch ๐ŸŒนbeautiful long hair younge new lily,must try,amazing oil strong to relaxing massage,very friendly smile,bring you comfortable warm time,must try๐ŸŒน๐Ÿ”ฅ
  49. @ AliceSpa:
    THURSDAY at ๐—”๐—Ÿ๐—œ๐—–๐—˜ ๐—ฆ๐—ฃ๐—”.4915 Steeles Ave. E, Scarborough ๐Ÿฐ๐Ÿญ๐Ÿฒ-๐Ÿฎ๐Ÿต๐Ÿด-๐Ÿฌ๐Ÿด๐Ÿต๐Ÿด. 3 girls here today at ALICE SPA. Open 10am to 9pm: BEBE (12pm-9pm) is a young slim Vietnamese girl with a beauty face, C Cup, 5'2" & 100 Lbs, student and model looks, vg at fs multiple positions, bbbj ymmv must be clean and respectful. CLOUDIA (10am-9pm): is Vietnamese, young, petite 5'2" & 96 Lbs, B Cup
  50. @ Jennyโ€™s Spa:
    ๐ŸŽ‰๐Ÿ’JENNYโ€™S SPA๐ŸŽ‰๐Ÿ’ โœ…5170 DUNDAS STREET WESTโœ… ๐Ÿ‘ŒETOBICOKE ONTARIO M9A 1C4๐Ÿ‘Œ โ˜Ž๏ธ( 647-893-5196)โ˜Ž๏ธCall or Text โ˜Ž๏ธ( 437-888-3759)โ˜Ž๏ธCall Only (ETOBICOKE) OPEN 10am to 9pm MONDAY to SUNDAY ๐Ÿ”ฅโœ…GRAND OPENING๐Ÿ’ฏNEW GIRLS EVERYDAY๐Ÿ”ฅEXCELLENT MASSAGE + SERVICE QUEENS NOW AVAILABLE AT JENNYโ€™S SPA FOR ALL YOUR MASSAGE AND SPECIAL EXTRA NEEDS๐Ÿ”ฅ๐Ÿ’ฏ๐Ÿ˜˜๐Ÿ”ฅโค๏ธ๐Ÿ‘Œ ๐Ÿ”ฅTWO BEAUTIFUL NEW YOUNG ASIAN GIRLS EVERYDAY๐Ÿ”ฅ ๐Ÿ’ฏREAL PICTURES OF ATTENDANTS๐Ÿ’ฏ ๐Ÿ”ฅ๐Ÿ’‹Limited Time Special Promotion๐Ÿ”ฅ๐Ÿ’‹ โœ…๐Ÿ’ฆ30 Minutes Nude Mass
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