The line between a Positive Hobby and an Addiction

[Nuge]

It was a question raised on another board that made me think about this. Pasted below is the main body of my response. Since eforum.xxx has more members, I am curious about what others think, especially those that have been hobbying for 5, 10 or 15 years and longer. This is not intended to dampen the enthusiasm of those who are having a great time. Only to get some input from others like me who have experienced massage over many years.

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One has to be brutally honest and look at oneself. There is no need for public dialogue or assessment questionnaires etc. Over several months and years, if your life evolves in a satisfying multi-faceted direction then it is a positive force, If on the other hand your most satisfying moments are related to "going for the next session", then it is no longer a positive thing.

Very few people have the ability to enjoy something for a while and then move on to other challenges and experiences. That is the fundamental problem. If it continues to remains on the level of "I've just got to try one more masseuse that I just heard about", then sooner or later it is a problem. On purpose, I'm staying away from issues such as financial, family, friends, self-esteem etc. (any book on addiction will walk you through all of those).

A bigger problem arises when you KEEP GOING BACK FOR MORE OF WHAT YOU WERE NOT LOOKING FOR. Example - shitty massages, lists of options that you don't care for, getting shorted on time, greedy people, dirty surroundings etc. etc.. Very often we have a few memorable experiences in the early phases and then we keep going back, again and again, trying to get the same feeling one more time. In the meantime, you don't find pleasure in other simple activities anymore, because your mind is a prisoner of your habits. Your mind is now a thief that steals your peace and joy from the rest of your day. That is the real downfall of an addiction. You are seeking goodness that already resides in you. But you seek it externally - there is no end to that search (resulting in a mixed bag of experiences - always hoping for a better one - next time, maybe - one last time, that's it - etc.). There are lots of people who are ready to engage your ego and your fantasies and will gladly take your money - until you begin to feel disgusted. But you still keep going back, until, one day you realize that one could have an unending series of bodily experiences but still not be getting any closer to real satisfaction. Pleasure(s) does not equal happiness. What gave you joy when you were a child? It bubbled out from within you ... the realization is a turning point. Now you are ready for a real change.
******


What have your experiences been like when you look back over several years?

 

[a r]

I'll bite, even though I'm a bit of a newbe. I guess I had my first erotic massage about three years ago. I go back and forth between thinking it's a good thing and thinking I'm damaging myself in some psycological/spirtual way. After a good session I'll be in a good mood for the rest of the day, sometimes longer. I had a connection with that person. I enjoyed it, I believe she enjoyed it. I had a new experience, felt something I never felt before. And I have some basic needs for a) release and b) intimacy. Every person is different, with a different look, a different way of interacting, a different way of touching. It's like trying out different restaurants, cuisines, music. It's also exciting, an adventure. There is an element of risk, of discovering hidden treasure. I like the illicit, hidden aspect of the whole thing.

On the down side, it's expensive and I can't justify the expense in any rational way. Dropping $120 for a massage once is ok, but I'd hate to go back and calculate my average monthly expenditure over the past couple of years. I guess the money is the biggest problem for me personally and it probably keeps me from becoming an addict.

I've wondered if it might make me jaded or somehow undermine non-paying sexual and romantic relationships, but I don't think so. It's true that some of these girls provide services that most girlfriends will never provide. But it goes the other way as well. Massages are no substitute for a real relationship. So I think the two are complimentary.

I don't think it functions like an addiction for me. If I have a good experience I want more. If I have a bad experience I'm not satisfied and I want more. But as I said, money is a constraint for me. And when the "high" wears off I don't go into depression and have to rush back. A good experience does make me feel good about myself, but my self esteem depends much more on other things in my life.

I do think I have an unhealthy addiction to eforum.xxx, checking the boards when I should be doing my work ;-)

 

[Peachy]

Many eforum.xxx members suffer from this addiction, including myself

M2

 

[I Need Coffee]

Same goes for me (I should be working now)

 

[Erik Star]

Wow, people actually browse eforum.xxx at work? Are there a lot of tele-commuters here or something?

Where I work, internet usage is monitored. Amongst the restrictions:

"Downloading or viewing of sexually explicit material is stricly prohibited."

I believe eforum.xxx would qualify under that, especially with those wonderful SP ads up in the corner.

 

[Vemsteele]

muddy,

You have a great honest attitude and you are maintaining your awareness about your experiences. That is super. You will always look towards bringing out the good in each experience. I know that over the years I was not just looking out for myself but also for the masseuses who added to my well being. (My post was originally in the massage section but was moved by the moderator to the general section).

You mention an important factor that captures most intelligent people -the possibility of adventure - CURIOSITY. That certainly gets us all. Later on it becomes important to discriminate between a truly new experience versus rehashing an old one with new window dressing.

I did not post in order to throw a damp towel on other people's activities, but to genuinely see how others are thinking.

I salute you,

Dak

 

[Cap The Technician]

Part of what makes it a good experience for me is feeling like I actually made a connection with the other person. I wouldn't want to think that the girl went away crying or had to throw up after the session or that I was complicit in this person screwing up her life, as someone suggested in another recent thread.

http://eforum.xxx.ca/vbulletin/showthread.php?p=104587#post104587

The couple of times where I've felt the girl really didn't want to be there, are the times I've been depressed about the whole business.

I wonder about always looking for new experiences too. I guess we won't run out of new girls to see, but there are certainly many different kinds of services discussed on these boards that I haven't tried yet. Will I get blasé about massage? Is it the gateway drug to something more dangerous? Am I corrupting myself? Will I be irreparably damaged? I'm not really worried, but I think about these things.

 

[GeorgeRock]

I've been doing this for a little over five years. I look forward year round to my trips to Montreal to hobby. It is an escape from reality for me, like going to a fantasy camp where I get to be a young stud again. I think marriage and midlife hit me hard. I missed being out enjoying the company of different ladies when after the honeymoon was over my wife started to go to bed at 9PM leaving me alone in a silent house to try and entertain myself.

I told myself I was older and had serious responsibilities now versus when I was young and carefree. I accepted that in exchange for the comfortable lifestyle and peace of mind that we now enjoyed I must give up the pursuit of frivolous, possibly dangerous activities that could hurt not only myself but my family as well. So for years I led the life of a puritan(in my eyes anyway). I stopped drinking almost entirely, never went out anywhere except for the occasional movie or dinner, and rarely ever spoke with another woman. It was usually a night in front of the TV with a DVD played on a great home theater system we bought. But how many times could I watch T2 and still feel excited about life?

One day I realized that I was trying to be something that I'm not. I wasn't happy with a prudish relationship that had soured. I felt like I had been deceived into being a sperm donor by a Black Widow and then eaten by her. I realized that my choice to practice total self denial of sexual enjoyment other than some pretty good porn was not good and when she started complaining about the fact that I had some porn I knew there was going to be trouble. For a marriage to work the woman must be committed to appeasing her man in any reasonable way possible. I needed a hot mama but I was stuck with a "Grand"mama. I was not ready to neuter myself through celibacy or a begged for two minute quickie in missionary once a week.

We seperated amicably as a matter of course but manage to stay friendly and she now seems to be much nicer to me since I am no longer bothering her for sex. I was lonely for a while since taking care of children and working full time leaves very little time for enjoyment. Dating was inconsistent and sexual frustration built quickly. Then one day I read a story about the Montreal sex industry. It sounded too good to be true. I started extensive research and planned a trip. I was ecstatic with the experience, literally. LOL

I learned much from eforum.xxx and through my own personal experience so I usually have good encounters with the SP's I see. I have even found a few who I would like to repeat with and maybe stay in touch with as friends, a "mistress" in Montreal if you will, time will tell. I guess you could say I am addicted to having enjoyable sexual experiences with good looking young ladies but what honest heterosexual man would deny that universal truth? Could I quit? I don't know, but it would take a hot mama who kept the fire burning in our relationship to make me even consider giving up the pleasure I get in Montreal.

As far as how hobbying effects my life I don't think I have a "problem" in any sense of the word. I still get up every morning and do what I need to do, make a good living, and enjoy my family. I am still pursuing non Sp relationships as well. I just find that going to Montreal twice a year gives me an outlet for fantasy and leaves me with memories that help with self stimulation when I am at home. So maybe I have a problem with daily self manipulation of my genitalia while thinking about Montreal. I can live with that.

 

[Bambi]

The difference between hobby and addiction is the ability to walk away when you ahve to. A drug addict bothers nobody as he gets stone in his bedroom. But would he/she function normally in a society. Does he need later to steal and commit crime. Would he pay his rent? What about us?
What if we have to walk away from this when we’re broke or impotent for some reason? Will we find other hobby as interesting? It’s tough.
I have walked away form this and have come back because the urge is too strong, worse it’s the advertisement too present. A beer commercial with the bikini babe makes me want to touch her. I’ve said to myself that I have done many like her, but the urge is there. It’s primal and it’s something we want.
I’ve don’t a lot a few years ago. Almost once a week. It was a pleasure and SPs were more open as they are fresh from the scene. I treated them right and have had a few personal relationships with them. eforum.xxx did not exist then, and BBBJ was common. It was addictive, it was a necessity. Until the stock crash I slowed down on my addiction but came back only occasionally.
We all have a reason to be here, sex. They have a reason to service us, money.

 

[Lorrie Anderson]

I just read this thread and felt like I saw myself a bit.

I've been going to MP's for just over 1 year now and was in the SC scene (FS clubs) for over 5 years before that. I don't know if my situation is evolving or not, I would say it's a different experience for a different need.

I appreciate the closeness and sensuality of a good massage. And I say "good" in a relative way because let's stay real, it's very rarely therapeutic. When I get a connection with a masseuse, I remember the experience for days. I do only reward good service, no repeats for me if the service is bad. That's what I'm looking for at this time in my life. I also question myself as to a future relationship with a woman; because it has been a while, will things be different or will it be business as usual ? Who knows, I guess I'll wait and see.

Lately though, I have started to go more and more, to the rate of about 5 times a month, for the past 5 months. I have to question myself as to why ? Is my situation different ? Am I becoming addicted ? Is it just normal because I can afford it (so this versus something else) ? I also have to admit that I've exceeded my budget on two occasions. After the last time, I had to stop and re-examine my situation. I've decided to prove something to myself. I have decided to stop all hobbying for 3 months and see how everything is going and put things into perspective. It has now been 4 weeks. I've had a few urges but nothing I couldn't handle. I've also noticed extra cash in my bank account. I've bought a few things and realize that these purchases will stay with me for a long time (printer, books, clothes,...) rather than a short time (quick fix) that I got from my visits to an MP. I'll just stay the course and go from there.

I know that others might have different stories or different situations. This is just my story. Hope this helps, I know it helped me to type it out.

Gambling Fool

 

[Miss G]

I also see myself in some of these other posts. I'm married and my sex life isn't great at home. I miss the times when I had an active social life, always meeting new people, parties, clubs, the excitement of new relationships. So clearly it's a substitute for me. But on a good day I think that even if I were on my own, dating, with an active sex life, I would still want to get an occasional massage. Private sex is no substitute for a good erotic massage...

But whenever I have sex with my wife I always think, Ka-ching, I just saved $120! ;-)

 

[?u??sfloozy]

Muddy,

Thank you for that, you've got my vote for quote of the year! ROFLM!

 

[Artie]

I have been going to MP once a month for over a year an a half now, well a little bit more often then that since I exceeded my budget a few times.Financially that’s a level of hobbying that I can afford.

But sometime when my wife look at me with those loving eyes I feel bad!Sex is very good at home so I can’t use that one as an excuse. She may not be the sexiest girl around but I always said that what goes in your head account for 95% of what sex is and I firmly believe that. She is one of the brightest person I know and she’s been making me happy for over ten years now.
So the question is why am I going then?

Because I am a man mostly, it is so hard to see all those beautiful women on St-Catherine and to tell myself that I don’t have access to anyone of those. So I think it is a kind of compensation for all those babes I see that I can’t touch.But since sex is good at home I’m not looking for that, I mean fs or bj, only a good massage and a hand job and to be able to touch and to give pleasure to that beautiful girl just beside me.
Could I stop just like that?

That is the 40 000$ question.Or maybe a better one would be do I want to?Sometime I think the monetary aspect of it will motivate me to stop, I’m not poor but I’m not rich either and there may be some better use for that money then this as Gambling Fool said.So I am surely addicted at some point but not to the extend that my life is miserable even if it’s playing some tricks with my peace of mind.If I weren’t married I would not have any second though about it if it stayed at the level it is right now.

I hope this post is not too heavy, I do not want to dampen your mood . I felt the need to express myself and tought it was the right place to do so.

If there is some inconsistency in my righting blame it on me being French! But since French it is so hard to write down it would probably not be better if I where to write that way!

But maybe I should I noticed that there is a lot of French people on this board, I would like to hear the opinion of some experienced registered user about that as I now it can be a sensitive issue.

Letmeloose
---------------
People demand freedom of speech as a compensation for the freedom of thought which they seldom use.

 

[Atmey]

Muddy, LOL, but from my perspective part of what I am paying for is the freshness, uniqueness and variety of new sexual partners. I hear the same complaint from the majority of my married friends.......as the saying goes, the honeymoon wears off quickly, and most of them are very bored sexually. They justify the boredom with the "I get it for free" argument. But maybe boring sex should be for free?

 

[rico]

eb- regarding the "i get it for free" comment i just might add that a lot of guys that say that are very jealous individuals who are mad that we do what we do because they can not afford it and we are able to do it with very beautifull and gorgeous women.(just my 2 cents)

 

[Drayak]

Joe.t... perhaps jealousy is indeed a factor... but then, maybe not... An SP gives you what you want (you hope) when you want it. In order to "get it for free" you have to let life take its course. Money was often an issue for me, although I still managed to hobby in the leanest of times.

It had everything to do with loneliness... and extreme libido...lol. Of course, I often felt guilty afterwards, for a variety of reasons. Gambling Fool, I concur. Everytime I see an MP (I haven't seen an SP in years) I think to myself... hmmm, that was one trip to the grocery store, or a new skin for my drums, or a new woodworking tool... all things that have longer value than a sixty minute romp. On the other hand, massage soothes my aching muscles and the occasional release soothes my soul... ok, my libido.

But nothing compares to spending a few hours with someone you know, talking, exchanging ideas... and bodily fluids. There are risks involved with seeing an SP... I don't think I need to enumerate them. Some will say the disease factor ids no higher with an SP because they get tested, they practice safe sex... bla bla bla... Well, what of the SP's boyfriend... or the ones where mileage is higher? Who the hell knows where their nether regions and tongues have been? The truth is it takes only one mistake to get infected, SP or otherwise. And then there is the emotional factor, not everyone deals with that very well.

In this disposable society where everything is bought and sold, isn't it time for a little humanity? Yes, I'm a fool, the oldest profession will always exist, and it doesn't "really" hurt anyone. We're not talking about exploited teens, of course. But love IS lost when an SP is paid hundreds of dollars to get biblical. I for one don't necessarily think it's the way to go.

Strangely, some of the best release sensations I ever got were after an hour of soothing and teasing from an MP. As far as lovemaking, nothing will ever compare to my experiences with real world women (easy there, I'm not saying SPs are not real women). When body, mind, and soul connect in passionate lovemaking... nothing can compare. I almost fainted once, upon coital consumation... we were in a bathtub and I was on top. The floating sensation, the heat, and my feelings for the woman made for an explosive experience indeed. I have never felt that with an SP, even ones I connected with and repeated with.

The truth is that intimacy cannot be bought, neither can love or people... or can they? Apparently everything can be bought. I'm not puritanical in any way, I love sex, PSEs, gorgeous women... but I can get love and PSE for free (along with the occasional headache, lol). And don't start in about the cost of marriage, outings, etc... well, marriage yes, I've done that and I'm not doing it again (I'm divorced). But the women I meet never expect money from me. Those that do are out the door.

Where, pray tell, can you find love with an SP? The minute you drop coin for sex that idea goes out the window.

 

[Fiona]

I don't know if it's human (male) nature or if it's something we learn, but I can't imagine being satisfied with one woman for the rest of my life. I've been with women where I've lost all interest in others, where I wouldn't even see a beautiful girl walk by, where I would get back to her as soon as I could. But how long does that last? A day, a week, a month? I don't care how good it is at the beginning, eventually it gets old and you want to move on. But you're committed in one way or another, you don't want to hurt that person, you may love that person and still want to be with them on some level. But the lust is gone, looking for other outlets.

 

[Truth]

One more thing:

I used to live near this punk bar in Berlin that had a sign:

"home fucking is killing prostitution"

 

[William R]

This is a very informative thread by the way, lots of mature discussion, who said men cannot open up with feelings and emotion.
I have to agree with muddy and others who have talked about the need for variety. For me two things make me hobby. 1 is that I have a very strong libido, at 44, I have yet to see the effects of aging in terms of stamina, endurance and if anything I think , in fact I know that I am better in bed now than when I was in my twenties. Call it success, self assurance, or experience but I still wake up every morning wanting and hoping to get laid. 2nd reason, is I believe that in the fabulous world of sex, variety IS the spice of life. I am happily married, my wife is attractive and turns heads all the time and we have a good sex life but I still enjoy the feeling of being with someone else once in a while. Perhaps it comes from the primale male instinct of pursuing and getting the female of the species or perhaps I am just a sex addict. I don't know. I know that sex, is a drug and can be addictive.
In a magazine, I recently took a survey on sex addiction (for what it's worth) and indeed based on my honest responses, I did show signs of sex addiction. Does that mean that I have encounters on a regular basis... Of course not, several factors such as budget, opportunity and yes self control curb my urges. As long as it stays that way, I am having a ball

 

[Sarah_bacc_in_action]

My memories of when I was 8 was 'I am so glad they make us carry books between class' beceause anything would give wood! This does not convince me that I may be addicted to anything. I just have a natural tendency to be a bit more physical than most. Just a happy taurus. I didn't even get laid until I was 18, poor girl....

Happy me, I spent the next 5 yeas on the road touring with bar bands. A verry sexually active life.

Throughout the next years I was mostly envolved with one woman at-a-time and was fine with that. Some appreciated my drive and some not. In between relationships, I toyed with the profesional(s). I never got much satisfaction, outside of the obvious.

I am in my forties, making a decent living and am single again. My last relationship was 7 years long, and emotionally draining. This caused me to look a my life and assess what I wanted. I did and I now know. I am happy and not actively looking for a spouse. I now enjoy my time with the girls, beceause I can put them in perspective.

Well, I can still go MSOG every day. I still enjoy it. But it is with these realizations.....

1) It is all about the money. It's a business and it's their living. I know it and she knows it. I just leave it implied. Cash is on the table, in an envolope marked accordingly. She does not have to ask and I don't have to say. Mood killer taken care of.
2) Connect. If I would not have this girl as a freind, odds are that she would not be that much fun. Respect is a two way street, and I like regulars. Not that I will HAVE this girl as a freind, but the personality must be able.
3) Real good actor or someone who actually enjoys what I do. It is, after all, my moment. Bad acting or distant looks are a big mood killer.
4) We all went to kindergarten. I know how to tell time and I know she does. Girls you should not be obvious. implied.......
5) I have my stable that I use. They know me and I them. I know what to expect and the same for them. Happy campers.


A simple act of sex can be seen as adictive when you need something that isn't going to be there. You tend to go back looking for it, but never finding it. I have realistic expectations and get realistic results. The girls I frequent are more relaxed and tend to beable to deliver what I want, pleasure and a fantasy. It's fun with no stigma!

Addictions are compensations for something missing in your life. What you do is not the adiction, just the result. If you like sex, as I do, look at it differently.